[sicnarftea]

I have, tried two seperate MLMs, both failed as both of them sold the opportunity and not the product.

I feel alot safer and alot more incontrol with my own business. You do what you like when you like, have the products and services you like and sell at the prices you want (or the market price).

To tell the truth MLM is just a lazy excuse of a business plan for people who don't really want to go that extra mile to formulate their own product and their own business. I have nothing against it, just that when people start making speeches about how great MLM is and how everyone who doesn't participate are closed minded it really ticks me off.

Its funny because the majority of the members in this forum has their own business runninng already, and by saying that none of us has challenged ourselves in that sense, and that we need to open our mind up is just plain stupid. I'm sure people would agree with me that starting out our own thing would be alot harder than joining an MLM.

So please don't say that as its just insulting for most of us. We know MLM works for you, and no it doesn't work for us because we prefer developing our own products/business/plans etc etc. You are probably a hard working bloke and using MLM as a second source of income or something, but most of us depend solely on our business as our primary income. So most of our time would be spent on growing that business and making more income streams from it.

[sl.market]

My Opinion on MLM


Multi Level Marketing is in fact a very good design by concept for the business. The best MLM are the ones that are designed around a really good product. The reason most MLM's fail are because of bad products and too many variables.

If there is a bad product, no one wants to buy, no one goes anywhere....

Too many variables, this is a common problem, this usually comes from a poor business structure where the person can receive income up to 7 levels. This is just ridiculous, great selling point, but usually people get screwed.

With too many variables the selling point is not the product, but the idea of being a part of MLM.

MLM got a bad reputation because of the internet. The internet opened up so much for MLM and it went so bad , so quick. The problem being that most programs and systems represent some form of MLM so when there is a legit one, it loses its confidence.

These MLMs that are bad are like Randomizer's, where you pay $2 to the admin, $5 to the refeeree, and $3 to the refeerees refeerer. This creates some type of pyramid, and the MLM is the system.

Then you have things like the simple follow what I did. You pay the admin $10.00 for set up, you pay the reffer $5.00, the admin then sets you with a small mini site, they catch you by using techniques like, "Look aren't you interested, how hard ca it be", and "get $5.00 over and over again".

Now, these actually ARE NOT scams. The people a head of these programs don't intend to SCAM anyone, it is just easy money for them. All these programs first work when they start....

For example, the dollar randomizer.

If you have 5 people in the randomizer, your more liekly to be chose on the front page. If there were 100 your chances are slim... However, I know peple who joined liek 40 randomizzers when they first came out, and made around $3k.


THe problem with Multi Level Marketing that turns me off, is the sketchyness.

People say only the top make money, that is not essentially true... It is because the top know how to sell, how to market to people... ON the internet they will create lists and more... Talk to their clients.... Actually travel to talk to them... of course they ahve money to do this.

The Sketchyness comes from the lower end of the people. These are your desparate MLM whores, these guys THROW themselves on you. However, they are smart in knowing not to SPAM, but they try to gain their MLM reputation....

Agel Forums im pretty sure you are in the Agel MLM. So, my question is what you are doing gives me sketchyness more then Wanting to Join your program.

What you should do is the following:

1) Go to Forums and Communities that talk about your products.

2) Sell some Products

3) Then write a report on what you did to sell the products

4) Then come here, give the report away for free on selling products... and promtoe your MLM inside it.

INternet Marketers live and breath these computer wires, we know what everyone is up to... we know the scams, and we are the smartest people on the net.

Us Internet Entrepreneurs's have been through it all... So first this is a bad forum to be at....

Try affiliate marketing forums, because they like to sell other people products.

Well tahts all I can say for now.... PEace

[Bobby4]

good advice SI...i think the thread needs to stop because its on a loop...people answer to the thread title and someone tries to discuss the credibility of their company and mlm as an industry and its not really working...this is gettin old

[WanganRunner]

Ok, we still haven't yet hit on why most real entrepeneurial types dislike MLM's.

We're not salesmen by nature, most of us are too independent to be salesman. Hell, I'm downright antisocial, a recluse if you will, and I resent the idea that I have to convince people of something to make money. Most born salesmen make shitty CEO's and traders. It's easier to be a born manager or a born trader and then hire marketing people than to be the other way around.

Agelforums said that everything, one way or another, is network marketing, and I would like to challenge this idea.

None of the ventures I've ever entered myself into had any real marketing aspect to them whatsoever. I trade assets, and invest for either cash flow or capital gains. Cars, real estate, businesses, etc... I don't promote a damned thing, I just buy, sell, own, manage, hold, et cetera.

What I do, with any asset, is no different than what a bond trader does, it's arbitrage, and it has nothing to do with marketing. I find a mispriced asset, I purchase it, and I resell it for what it's worth, or I hold it for cash flows. When I sell a car or a business (let's say a vending machine route or a lawncare business), I just list it, and someone buys.

If I had 1,000 marketing people working for me, I wouldn't make a single goddamned dime more than I do right now, all by my lonesome. That's why I dislike it, because I recognize it as NOT BEING OF ANY INTRINSIC VALUE.


Well, that, and also what someone on the first page said. It brings people into this who have no business being here. Not everyone is cut out to work for themselves, and if you're motivated solely by easy money, you're likely going to be a pretty crappy entrepeneur.

MLM's attract people who *by definition* lack the intrinsic motivation to go out and do what it takes to be truly independent. These people need a system, and MLM provides (or claims to provide). Real entrepeneurs don't need a system, we don't need guidelines, and we don't take kindly to being a cog in a machine. If we did, we'd have regular jobs.

[pura vida]

Do you know what´s funny?

That so many people post on these discussion.

It seems that it is an very interesting theme.

Some like it, some hate it - so what.

Make your own opinion - that is the only thing I can suggest

[agelforums]

When it comes down to it .. the real hate and disgust I see towards MLM is that you guys dont think it is credible.

Believe it or not .. almost everything we do is network marketing, one way or nother, because MLM and Network Marketing is purely communication with a twist.

People that have joined me and my ventures have done it for two reasons.

1) Me

2) The Product

I have put Agel on hold because I have found a better product at a much cheaper price that is actually touching peoples lives and making them a healthier person.

So to say there is no value .. its wrong .. because sure some are and thats why MLM gets a bad name .. but there are truly good companies out there more about thep product or service than the opportunity and ive found one.

sicnarftea You said " I feel alot safer and alot more incontrol with my own business. You do what you like when you like, have the products and services you like and sell at the prices you want (or the market price)."

What do you think MLM is .. I do what I like when I like .. and I have the products and services that I like and I want to sell ..

Doing Ethos (gas company) isnt exciting or fun to me .. so I didnt join it .. no one makes anyone do MLM .. its purely your choice and you decide what you want to join and what you want to promote whenever you want ..

Next you said "To tell the truth MLM is just a lazy excuse of a business plan for people who don't really want to go that extra mile to formulate their own product and their own business. I have nothing against it, just that when people start making speeches about how great MLM is and how everyone who doesn't participate are closed minded it really ticks me off."

Again .. why put all that work into formulating a product or service that people want when you have taken away all the hard parts and knowledge and know how to do all of that .. and not to mention the money to get it off the ground ..

Thats why I do MLM .. to get other ideas off the ground and to free up my time for other plans I have down the future. So to call MLM people lazy .. is way out of the picture and your once again showing your close-mindedness towards people who do MLM.

And I never said people who DONT participate .. are close minded .. never said that and never will .. MLM isnt for everyone .. not even close .. but to the people who bash it, hate on it, and say negative things about it ARE very close-minded people and should do some research before throwing out ignorant comments "lazy people, crappy entrepreneurs, or no intrinsic value"

Because some companies out there .. are the complete opposite .. (like the one I just joined last week) and some companies really truly do care about the product, and the people who consume or use it.

[WanganRunner]

I wasn't necessarily saying that every single MLM is worthless, I was trying to communicate why, generally, people look upon them with some disdain.

That there may be any number of good ones doesn't really negate anything that I said.

As vida said, I'm just voicing my opinion. You asked, I'm answering, I'm not sure why my opinion would need to be contested, thats not how opinion works.

[agelforums]

Yeah I am fine with all opinions .. thats why I asked such a broad topic ..

Just trying to get a better understanding of "entrepreneur" minds as to why you guys look down opon it

[chadwick]

One of the reasons why MLM is hated in the capacity that we see it is because there are a lot of companies that have ruined and are continuing the ruin the very legitimate and viable system that we know as Network Marketing.

Every line of work has it's bad representations, and MLM is no exception. Many companies have large inventory fees to join, structures that enable only heavy hitters to make it....and a system that pretty much prepares the average joe for thinking he's going to get as rich as his upline when the fact is that he might be lucky if he gets to be earning a couple thousand a month.

However, Network Marketing, if done right, is one of the last hopes for the average person to make it, and anyone who looks down on the concept of the industry knows absolutely NOTHING about smart business. In fact, most of the millionaires in America come FROM Network Marketing. It is taught in Stanford and Harvard as a very legitimate way to do business.

MLM rocks, but there will always be the idiots.

p.s. sl.market made some VERY good points!

[agelforums]

Yeah I agree with Chadwick ..

Thats what I was talking about that this is a very good thing as long as you do some homework, research your company, and compare it to others in the same industry.

The simple fact that this can be done on your own time, how you want it, and you pick what you do and do something that excites you ..

I see no reason to just have pure hate towards it .. because it is a great business challenge and one that I think some are afraid to get into to accept the challenge that it presents.

Thats why I consider MLM and Entrepreneurs the same .. because you got to learn the business inside and out .. and learn what works and what doesnt and pick and choose the right way to do business

Otherwise your wasting your money and time ..

But when all said and done .. this is the best business in my eyes and one I want to do because of the excitement and challenge

[WanganRunner]

Originally Posted by chadwick

In fact, most of the millionaires in America come FROM Network Marketing.

While the majority of your paragraph is perfectly fine, this particular statement seemed like quite a claim to me. I'd love to see substantiation that the majority of Americans with a net worth of over a million dollars got there from Network Marketing.

I'd suspect it looks more like the following:

The majority of Americans with a net worth of over $1m (INCLUDING the worth of their home) got there vis-a-vis the appreciation of their home/second home. Most people's wealth is tied up in their residences.

The majority of Americans with a net worth of over $1m (EXCLUDING the worth of their home) got there from securities, most often corporate stock options/incentives. These people are obviously richer than those in the category above, if their net worth is >$1m without including their home. I'm less sure about this one than the one above, but I'm farking positive that the majority of this category didn't get to where they are from Network Marketing.


Now, I'm not disputing the claim that Network Marketing can, when properly applied, make someone a millionaire, I just thought that the claim that "MOST American millionaires are from Network marketing" to be a little overzealous.

[pura vida]

It´s fact that nearly about 5% will have great success in mlm.

Show me other lines of business where more than 5% will have the same success than the 5% from mlm.

For example: Not every car dealer will have great success - only a few % of all car dealers have great success.

You will only have success from hard working.

Have a nice day

[profitsharing]

The # 1 reason I hate MLM's is their "customers" aka "employees" aka "targets".

MLM's normally advertise in help wanted sections of the newspaper and internet. The people that fall victim to these scams are in most cases unemployed and or desperate. Like most things in life these scams hurt the people that are the most needy.

I believe laws should be in place to curb the profits of the MLM's.

First, any job should never cost money to obtain. McDonald’s makes its employees purchase there hats and shirts. However the money comes from the first paycheck. This would force MLM's to at least help you make back your start up cost.

Second, these MLM's should be forced to abide by the same laws as everyone else. Meaning, when Bob works 4 hours trying to sell his vitamins, he should be paid at least minimum wage.

Third, the government should implement a hiring tax of $100. This tax should then be deducted from the yearly Unemployment insurance paid by said company. In essence it would not affect legitimate business, but would ad to the cost of MLM's.

Forth, all job posting resources should be forced to screen potential ads. They should be held responsible at least in part to fraudulent job postings. This already exists in other fields. When a tabloid prints false reports on actors they sue for defamation of character.

Finally, their should be a law requiring company's who change their name to inform the public of such changes on any press release for a certain period of time. For instance, the job posting should read " ABC Inc, formally XYZ, is seeking highly..." This would prevent these MLM's from constantly changing their name to evade detection.

[BizMan101]

Quote from S.L Market

"My Opinion on MLM


Multi Level Marketing is in fact a very good design by concept for the business. The best MLM are the ones that are designed around a really good product. The reason most MLM's fail are because of bad products and too many variables.

If there is a bad product, no one wants to buy, no one goes anywhere....

Too many variables, this is a common problem, this usually comes from a poor business structure where the person can receive income up to 7 levels. This is just ridiculous, great selling point, but usually people get screwed.

With too many variables the selling point is not the product, but the idea of being a part of MLM."



The product is very important, it also helps to have a real strong upline support. I think most people hate MLM's because they are lured in by the money potential and they dont work the business or the product was crap and they fail.

Have to have an oustanding product!
Work the business!
Upline Support!
Help your downline succeed!
You will do just fine!

[pura vida]

So please don't say that as its just insulting for most of us. We know MLM works for you, and no it doesn't work for us because we prefer developing our own products/business/plans etc etc. You are probably a hard working bloke and using MLM as a second source of income or something, but most of us depend solely on our business as our primary income. So most of our time would be spent on growing that business and making more income streams from it.[/quote]

Do you realy think in these times it´s enough to have one business? What happens if you own business will not have success after a few years? Maybe now it´s ok but in some years. What happens if your business are not successfull after some years. Do you think then you have time to start a new business? Isn´t it better to have 2 or more businesses parallel? For example I´m having a main own business and a second income too. I feel safer with these second income.