[rogercbryan]

Originally Posted by flnazrael

Don't write it all off as sensationalism.

Your post only goes to inforce sensationalism... you are all hype and no real information.

The country is in serious trouble, and it's not just about gas prices.

Tomorrow the Senate is likely to authorize $800b to bail out Fannie & Freddie. Nevermind Bear Stearns. 150 banks are expected to fail next year. Hyperinflation is coming - maybe sooner than we think.

Please provide your source for the highlighted parts of this statement. You sound like one of those people who watches to much TV and does to little research to back up what you hear.

FDIC: Failed Bank List

Bank Failures by year:
2002 1
2003 2
2004 2
2005 5
2006 2
2007 0
2008 23

While there has been a significant increase in failures it hardly looks like 150 are going to fail next year.

Oil prices are dangerously close to a massive surge if (more likely "when") we go to war with Iran.

Source please? War with Iran is a bit far fetched. The facts are that our military is stretched to thin to open a third war front. The American Public will absolutely not support another war. Western Europe will not support another war. The Russian Federation will not allow another war. These are facts based on reading about the ACTUAL situation not the version that you see on the news.

The GOP presidential candidate wants to continue to keep dumping hundreds of billions into the Middle East, while the Democratic candidate wants to finish this country's descent into welfarism and socialism by taxing workers and business owners into oblivion.

Sounds like you should move to Canada.. you have very little faith in our economic and governmental systems. It is true that changes will take place no matter who comes into office. Obama does not.... ugh... your comment is so asinine it doesn't warrant a response... My company is well managed and can survive if Obama changes the capital gains tax. Will it mean I earn less money... yes... do I like that... no... but I'm not going to close my business because of it...

Stores are closing. Discretionary spending is going way down for most Americans. Obviously, this is not good for business.

Poorly run businesses close there doors during a good economy. If you are not planning for the worse case scenario then you are not protecting your business. If you are not diversified enough to survive a normal economic cycle then its your own fault when your business fails.

but truly, this economy does suck, and the country is headed down a very dark path in general.

Here are some resources where you can get accurate info. Please do some research and then come back to YE when you have something intelligent to say.
The Federal Pie Chart
United States federal budget, 2008 - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
http://assets.opencrs.com/rpts/RL34424_20080326.pdf

[matt_15]

musiclover, You don't get cheap&professional web designers. You could easily find expensive&professional web designers. You get what you pay for with web designers.

[matt_15]

oh and I think rogercybran proved you wrong flnazreal.

[flnazrael]

Re banks: Analysts: Personal Finance News from Yahoo! Finance

But the troubles are growing so rapidly at some small and midsize banks that as many as 150 out of the 7,500 banks nationwide could fail over the next 12 to 18 months, analysts say. Other lenders are likely to shut branches or seek mergers.

The American Public will absolutely not support another war. Western Europe will not support another war. The Russian Federation will not allow another war. These are facts based on reading about the ACTUAL situation not the version that you see on the news.

Maybe you've been living under a rock for the past few years...but this administration does whatever the hell it wants. Literally. The will of the people, the Congress, the UN, the world, George Bush has never given a damn about any of it. Why would he start now?

The lead up to war with Iran, the propaganda, has already begun. The same tired rhetoric we heard about Iraq. You haven't heard about the bill being pushed that would require a blockade on Iran? You think Iran won't go to war over that? You haven't heard about the Pentagon green lighting an Israeli first strike on Iran?

Read a newspaper every now and then.

you have very little faith in our economic and governmental systems.

Good point, I should change. They've just been doing such an incredible job, after all.

Poorly run businesses close there doors during a good economy.

You think the proportion of business closures is the same as it has always been?


Regarding hyperinflation, answer a simple question: when the money supply is doubled, what happens to the value of that currency? They're printing money like water to further prolong financial meltdowns, and there's no sign of this slowing down.

[flnazrael]

Oh, and if you want real numbers about the economy - not the inflated BS put out by the federal government, check out shadowstats.com.

And honestly, if you think that $4 gas is not putting a serious curb on discretionary spending for the average American, you are living in pure fantasy. It is not a good time to be in that type of business.

You also note that poorly run business will fail. Did it ever occur to you that the federal gov't is quite possibly the most poorly run business of all time? Multiple trillions in debt, outlandish waste and incompetence...yet I suppose the law of consequences doesn't apply to the government or the economy it so flagrantly interferes with?

Obama is going to be a nightmare for the economy. Democrats tax, then they tax some more. It cuts productivity, cuts profit, cuts expansion, hell, it's even proven to cut the gov't revenue they're seeking. What works is the conservative principle of letting the most productive people in society - business owners - pay far less tax. In case you think this is just a partisan jab, I'm very much against McCain as well. Between them, I don't know who's worse.

Lastly, I want to point out that I did say:

With that said, of course I believe there is still opportunity.

I think you just want to argue.

[rogercbryan]

Read a newspaper? Well after I finish the Wall Street Journal, The New York Times and the Washington Post I have little time for any more papers (each day).

I spent five years in the Marines and communicate still with a few people. So if you have more accurate information then what is coming from my officer buddies I'm all ears.

Did you mention you are getting your sources from a site called shadowstats.com, God forbid if I'm using WikiPedia and the FDIC... as there information is undoubtedly less valuable then shadowstats.com.... wow here is a quote from your 'reliable website'

"The material appearing on this website is based on data and information from sources we believe to be accurate and reliable. However, the material is not guaranteed as to accuracy nor does it purport to be complete. " you can find this at Disclaimer

i yi yi... I feel like a college graduate trying to talk to an elementary student... all hype no fact... seriously... you are the type of person that the media loves.. you believe all the hype and then you use terrible resources to back up your OPINIONS. There are a great deal of FACTS available when you use RELIABLE sources.

And honestly, if you think that $4 gas is not putting a serious curb on discretionary spending for the average American, you are living in pure fantasy. It is not a good time to be in that type of business.

So the price of gas has got consumers spending their money more wisely?
Gas Prices Force US Consumers to Reduce Discretionary Spending - MarketingVOX

People are being more frugal with their money... in my opinion Americans have been over indulging for years. If you want to have a serious conversation on gas prices then you have to take into account the price of gas in Europe. As their prices have been double or even triple those in the US for years. I guess everyone in Europe is living in boxes and eating Romen Noddle.

Really... take a few deep breaths... do some research... learn a little bit... the reality is much different then your fantasy.... as I have nothing better to do.. I stand ready for your rebuttal... please though... this time.. use some real sources that don't have disclaimers about the accuracy of their information... you are making it way to easy to prove you wrong.

And yes... I'm an ass... and yes I enjoy proving you wrong... thank you for a the good time!

[Doodyps]

Originally Posted by StealYourDreams

Wow, I guess I do learn something new everyday! You should get in touch with the RV industry and explain this hypothesis of yours.

Right, because RV's are marketed to millionaires all the time. Really? Youre talking about RV's? RV's are purchased by the middle class, which is affected by all kinds of economic problems in a recession. Items that sell well in a good economy that are marketed to wealthy people, sell just as well and are purchesed by the same people in a recession. Look at stuff like Polaris snow mobiles and 4 wheelers, they are selling fine. The kind of people that buy that stuff aren't hurting right now. Its the same with anything thats sold in Neiman Marcus. They will do fine in a recession. Seriously, what do you consider high-end? Leer jets are still selling. Yachts are still selling. RV's? Yeah, I'm pretty sure theyre having problems.

[flnazrael]

WikiPedia and the FDIC

WikiPedia is user generated and editable content.

FDIC is another arm of a corrupt federal gov't that has and is continuing to lie to the American people.

Do some research on who is behind shadowstats.com, and their background.

People are being more frugal with their money...

Do me a favor. Go down the main strip of whatever city you happen to live in. Take a notebook. Count the number of businesses offering services/goods that people need vs. those that they don't. I'm willing to bet the former GREATLY outweighs the latter.

Consumerism and excessive spending was the backbone of the explosive American economy (you said it, and I agree). When middle class people can barely afford to pay their mortgage anymore, buy gas, or put groceries on the table, guess what happens to those businesses?

And when most businesses start to fail, what happens? You think there's not a chain reaction?

For such a smart guy, you seem to just be another ignorant moron (ie., part of the problem in this country, not the solution). When you're ready to respond to all of my post instead of avoiding the parts you can't answer to, let me know. Until then, you're not worth anymore answers.

And if you think that this administration does not want war with Iran, you are a fool. And so are your supposed friends in the Marines. I have family members who have served multiple tours in Iraq - and they have been fed this Iran propaganda even before it appeared in the MSM.

Oh, and by the way - one of your dailies, the NYT, recently published a piece discussing the latest bailout, and the very serious financial reckoning the US is going to face. But you already knew that.

[flnazrael]

By the way, here's a link to edit the Wiki article you cited. Anyone can edit it - even dumbasses like you.


P.S. Invest in a grammar and spell checker before you insult people's intelligence.

[Ultimatum Dynamics]

Originally Posted by flnazrael

By the way, here's a link to edit the Wiki article you cited. Anyone can edit it - even dumbasses like you.

Personal attacks are immature an unnecessary.

This is an entrepreneurial forum. Not a boxing ring.

[Doodyps]

Its a recession, not the collapse of the US economy. Jesus. Oil and nat'l gas have been dropping like rocks, the price of gas will follow. I don't think it was the Bush administration that caused banks to wright bad loans. From what I've heard (particularly from a VP at ameriprise) is that the US economy will fare very well for the next two quarters, but then next year we will see some serious inflation problems and another round of bank problems. All that can change, considering there is almost no such thing as business news (its all old by the time anyone hears it), but it isnt supposed to be a rosie outlook for the next year and a half. However, we choose to live in a capitalistic economy/ society, so it comes with the territory. I'm of the belief that the less the govt does to "fix" everything, the better we are in the long run.

[flnazrael]

Doodyps,

My position is just that the govt can only borrow, bail, and print money for so long until it just stops working, or hyperinflation is triggered. And unless there is a massive shift in policy, that day will come at some point.

Oil and nat'l gas have been dropping like rocks, the price of gas will follow.

$4/gal is here to stay, at least for a good while. There are multiple factors propping up the cost of oil, and none of them are likely to go away any time soon - if ever.

I don't think it was the Bush administration that caused banks to wright bad loans

No, but if he had any concern about the long term health of the country, or the principles of capitalism in general, he wouldn't allow these bail outs and a Fed going wild printing money.

I also believe that his foreign policy has been absolutely disastrous both to the national security of the US, not to mention the insane amount of fiscal waste.

If they wanted a real stimulus in this country, they would pull out of Iraq, quit dumping money into that pit, and since they have a little extra, remove the federal gas tax and cut business tax. Instead, they're talking about yet another war. McCain has said "it doesn't matter" when asked when the troops could come home.

I'm of the belief that the less the govt does to "fix" everything, the better we are in the long run.

Agreed! That's why McCain, and especially Obama, scare me to death.

[flnazrael]

Originally Posted by Ultimatum Dynamics

Personal attacks are immature an unnecessary.

This is an entrepreneurial forum. Not a boxing ring.

Hi,

Unfortunately he has been rude and disrespectful since his original reponse - as I said, just wanting to argue about something and use generalizations and broad statements, not have any real discussion. So I'm not going to treat him with any respect.

I would gladly discuss any issue with someone who disagrees with me in a respectful manner, if they are also capable of doing so. Otherwise...

[KatherineB]

Start a business that helps other businesses promote themselves and do better during this slowdown.

When consumers have less money left over after paying more for gas, food and other essentials (and that's not going to improve anytime soon), they think twice before spending on non-essentials. Businesses therefore have to compete more for customers and need to be more "out there" to attract them.

Having said that, I agree that the very top end of the market (the super-rich) is still a good bet.

[tazman9r]

Originally Posted by flnazrael

McCain has said "it doesn't matter" when asked when the troops could come home.

On this subject, here is a quote from a New York Times article quoting John McCain at a rally in Ohio.

“By January 2013, America has welcomed home most of the servicemen and women who have sacrificed terribly so that America might be secure in her freedom,’’ Mr. McCain said at the Columbus Convention Center. “The Iraq War has been won. Iraq is a functioning democracy, although still suffering from the lingering effects of decades of tyranny and centuries of sectarian tension. Violence still occurs, but it is spasmodic and much reduced.’’

Get the full story here.

McCain Sees Troops Coming Home by 2013 - The Caucus - Politics - New York Times Blog

This has always been McCain's stance. This opinion comes from looking at the history of post WWII Japan, Germany, and Post war Korea. Oh, and by the way, did you know we were still in Bosnia? No one wants to be reminded about "Clinton's War", and we are still there nearly a decade later.

Partial quotes meant to generate misunderstandings are a major problem. The truth is that we, the general public, only know what we are told. Pick your favorite news source or blog, unless your reading a story of an individual's experience on the ground, you can't trust your not getting a political slant in whatever your news is. If you find news you like to read because it fits your political bent, then go ahead, but don't try preaching that news as gospel because it's probably going to get challenged with opposing articles.