[Talphin]

Hello all,

I will start this by saying that I just found this site, and this is my first post.

The reason I am writing this is because I just cannot seem to find the right direction to getting a business actually running.

A little history on me: (I will try to keep it short)

I have been trying to get some kind of a business running for at least the past 6 years with no luck at all. One falure after another, and I am at a point now where I feel I need to seek some kind of guidence somehow.

I started my career as a graphic designer. I landed in the web design industry working for a small company designing websites for several companies. I had always had cool ideas for inventions and such, but never had the skills or resources to make them happen. As a web designer, I now had the ability to "design" a website.

I worked for several years at that same company, and was actually offered partnership, accepted, and then immediately passed up for it for "the new guy". I was devistated. But it made me realize that working for someone else is never going to lead me anywhere. If I want to be somebody, I have to do it myself.

I partnered with a friend of mine (also a designer), and we started a company of our own while still working full time at the design company. It was a web design / hosting business. Nothing new of course, just 2 talented guys trying to get away from working under someone else. Bare in mind that I was only making about $30K a year working full time, and I took a chance and dumped about $6K into dedicated servers, and lots of targeted marketing. We had tons of hits, but in 2 months not 1 single client. I had no choice but to cut the funding to the server and the advertising before I went completely broke. Shortly after, my so called "friend" and business partner vanished, leaving me with more than $7K in debts.

My next 2 attempts was with "marketing gurus". The first one approached me asking me to partner with him. I do the designs, he handles the sales. Great! Where do I sign?! Well, who knows. He vanished as well.

The second one actually stuck around long enough for me to design the company website (this time I wasn't brave enough to invest money into an actual business). Before I even finshed the site, he also vanished into thin air!

ok. So far, I have been offered and revoked a partnership, and have had 3 others "vanish" with one of them leaving me several thousand dollars in debt.

At this point, the word "partner" makes me squeamish.

I could go out and just freelance jobs, but to tell you the truth, I really have no interest in being a designer for the rest of my life.

I had some ideas for websites that I thought would be a big hit. I could not afford to hire a programmer, and because I really don't trust "partners" anymore, I needed to learn web programming to make these ideas come true. And that I did.

Now after 2 years of programming experience, and 10 years of designing, I have more than enough experience to take a website from concept to production all on my own, and make it look great, as well as be a fully functional data driven web application.

I now have a total of 4 websites that I have attempted, and see no progress with any of them. Some of them bigger failures than others, but either way, I have managed to make a total of $70.00 from only one of them...

I know that my major weakness is in marketing, but for the time I have opened some of these sites, and the amount of traffic I have gained for each of them is quite laughable.

My most recent project is pretty cool. A free community website which allows users to find public parties, or post public and private parties online, and invite friends or the world to RSVP.

I just invested almost $1K into it because I had faith that it would at least draw some attention.

I payed for search engine submission, a professional press release, announced it on a huge news site, and even put up a $200 bonus for referring new members. It has been open for 3 weeks now, and the only members I have, are either friends and family or people I have personally invited to come visit the site. The site is http://www.partyblaze.com

I know it is still too early to chalk it up as a complete waste of time and money, but I somehow half expected to see some kind of response to it by now.

Well, I don't know what to do at this point. I still work a full time job, and have no imaginable idea of where to go. I spend every evening and every weekend working and working to try to get somewhere, but it all seems to be fruitless.

I am not ready to give up just yet, but I am not feeling very optimistic at the moment. In fact I am feeling very "dazed and confused" as stated in the subject.

I also have ideas for a few amazing inventions, in which I have no idea of what to do about them. I know nothing about patents, I have no money to invest in them, and I am not going to destroy them by going to some invention submission corp. I just don't know what to do.

I am not here looking for money, I am not here looking for partners. I am simply lookging for a light in my darkest hour.

[dre]

It seems like you need to learn more about the legal and marketing sides of business as well as search engine optimiztion. Your site partyblaze is two months old and has a total of 8 links for link popularity. Link popularity is one of the biggest keys to ranking high in search engines.

As far as the legal stuff you need to work out agreements if you ever work with partners again so you don't get screwed over. Make sure you have a lawyer and accoutant you can always talk to.

[Talphin]

I agree 100% with you. I know about the link popularity, and I am working on that part. I actually opened the site only 3 weeks ago. I had been working on it for a month before that.

As far as legal and marketing, I am really not in any kind of financial situation to hire lawyers or marketing, and not sure I can spend the next 10 years of my life studying both. My step dad is an accountant, but I am not making any money on my business at all, so I have no reason to ask for his help at the moment.

I don't think I am interested in another partner though. You never know. That might change.

I am not expecting to become a millionaire overnight, or ever for that matter. I aim to, but I would be very content right now to just be able to work for myself, and actually generate enough money to support myself, my wife and my daughter while not living in a trailer park. I just can't seem to be able to get my feet wet here.

Originally Posted by dre

It seems like you need to learn more about the legal and marketing sides of business as well as search engine optimiztion. Your site partyblaze is two months old and has a total of 8 links for link popularity. Link popularity is one of the biggest keys to ranking high in search engines.

As far as the legal stuff you need to work out agreements if you ever work with partners again so you don't get screwed over. Make sure you have a lawyer and accoutant you can always talk to.

[Outta Hand]

Hello there,

Just reading your posting about being "Dazed and Confused". It sounds and looks like you've been through enough experiences in business which is good to see.

You sound like the type of person who a "global thinker" meaning that you look and see the big picture but its the little details that may throw you for a loop sometime (this is the way my brain thinks about ideas and concepts). Again i don't know you but i thought i would offer that thought.

Also, i think that those things you've been through aren't failures simply lessons to guide you. I had a look at your sites and i've got to say wow because those are some unique ideas and i love to see that. I once read an article about Partnering and the reasons why you should do it and they break down into the following....

Partnering for financial reasons - If you don't have the money to start something you'd look to partner with an investor after trying to get a line of credit from the back

Partnering to gain outside Resources - If you start a company then you quickly realize that you naturally don't have all the skills to run a successful company so this is a way to enlist outside help.

I myself would never partner or work with family or friends and it makes me nervous anytime a friend asks me for a job or work. Its a rule i live by personally and sounds like you had to learn that one the hard way. Keep your friends as friends, family as family and business as business.

Some questions I have for you are...

1. You seem to have the passion to be successful and i am certain that one day you will... why are you not spending more time learning about marketing?
2. Your Project Penthouse site is an interesting idea, do you make any money off of it per month?
3. Your PartyBlaze site is another interesting site... what are you doing to market it?
4. Have you thought about taking a few courses... i would recommend Business Law(learning how to write business contracts and such), project development and marketing and sales?

The only way you get good at anything is by practicing and learning from mistakes. Now you've made a few good mistakes and who of us hasn't? Tell me more about your situation and i'll offer any advice or suggestions i can. Talk soon and feel free to private message me. Cheers

[Talphin]

Originally Posted by Outta Hand

You sound like the type of person who a "global thinker" meaning that you look and see the big picture but its the little details that may throw you for a loop sometime (this is the way my brain thinks about ideas and concepts). Again i don't know you but i thought i would offer that thought.

This is very true of me. I have many ideas, but I commonly try to stick to ideas that are useful or interesting to a huge number of people. I do tend to be a bit anxious to generate interest in my projects, and when I see no results, I get bummed out.

Originally Posted by Outta Hand

Also, i think that those things you've been through aren't failures simply lessons to guide you. I had a look at your sites and i've got to say wow because those are some unique ideas and i love to see that. I once read an article about Partnering and the reasons why you should do it and they break down into the following....

Partnering for financial reasons - If you don't have the money to start something you'd look to partner with an investor after trying to get a line of credit from the back

Partnering to gain outside Resources - If you start a company then you quickly realize that you naturally don't have all the skills to run a successful company so this is a way to enlist outside help.

I myself would never partner or work with family or friends and it makes me nervous anytime a friend asks me for a job or work. Its a rule i live by personally and sounds like you had to learn that one the hard way. Keep your friends as friends, family as family and business as business.

Thank you, I am glad you like the sites. I certainly agree with the comments about partners after the experiences I have had.

Some of my projects I have not quite chalked up as "failures" yet. Just projects that need "something". What that something is, I can't seem to find.

Here is a complete list of my "business" sites, and why I think they are not a success.

http://www.netyears.com
A website which would allow schools to publish their yearbooks to the site, and allows students to buy the digital yearbooks. The site takes a small cut of the sale, and gives the rest to the student who bought it.

I opened it up at the peak of yearbook season. I wanted to start local, so I sent personal letters to 200 local schools. Not 1 person responded.

Downside? Too risky for the school. I am a nobody, and the only way I can get traffic is by actually having yearbooks on the site. Why waste 2 months of time building an online yearbook when I have no prior interest in the site?

http://www.mmocasino.com
Idea: Build a web based casino that allows online RPG gamers to "gamble" their in-game gold in a real world style casino. Brilliant idea! There are millions upon millions of these gamers, and none of them have a real casino to gamble their gold.

Problems:
The game companies apparently frown on this, and threaten to ban the accounts of gamers who use it! WHAT?! Of course I didn't learn that until I actually started generating traffic.

On top of that, gamers seem to be affraid that the website is somehow "illegal".

Not to mention it is a 100% hands on operation for no profit at all.

I have given up on mmocasino, and chalked it up as "fun" instead of "business".

You have met my other 2 websites.

Originally Posted by Outta Hand

Some questions I have for you are...

1. You seem to have the passion to be successful and i am certain that one day you will... why are you not spending more time learning about marketing?
2. Your Project Penthouse site is an interesting idea, do you make any money off of it per month?
3. Your PartyBlaze site is another interesting site... what are you doing to market it?
4. Have you thought about taking a few courses... i would recommend Business Law(learning how to write business contracts and such), project development and marketing and sales?

1. I am, and thank you. I simply don't know where to start with marketing. I am not really a "classroom" kind of guy. I tought myself design and programming from reading books and doing it. I tried reading a business book, and in the first chapter it told me to "find my success posture and meditate..." I laughed, threw down the book and said something to the effect of "This is a waste of time... I have work to do..."

2. I started it off charing a $5 one time fee for the single and $10 for the double, as well as $1 per point to "climb". I made $70 in the first week (most of it from the guy in the penthouse). Then it died. Nobody else was signing up. So I made the single story free, and added a referral system, and started targeting the design community instead of the marketing community. That didn't work either.

3. I have a few ideas that I am working on, but I am having a hard time actually doing them. Right now I want to find some big events, and find communities talking about it. I will then post the event details myself, and invite the community to RSVP to it on my post.

4. I have thought about it. I just don't know enough about what I "need" to take, Vs. what sales people are going to "tell me I need".

[Day2]

Sorry for the rough luck.

One thing that you probably already know-- do more due dilligence on your partners. Legal docs aside, you need to have a better handle on who they are, what their goals are, etc. I've had lots and lots of partners (well 3 or 4 on assorted ventures) and not had a bad experience with one of 'em.

I imagine there's a bit of luck involved, too.

Don't be shy of partnership... Just read up, research, and do it better. Two good brains are 3 times better than 1 good brain.

One of the problems with the web today is that ANYONE can make a cool web site/app. That means that, even if you're idea is terrific, getting buzz is HARD. Bad signal-to-noise ratio.

I think PartyBlaze is pretty darn cool, but the marketing budget for such a thing would need to be huge. I don't know how much demand/need there is for such a thing. Ideally, you should run your idea by as many people as possible and hopefully you should get a lot of "Wow, if a web site like that existed, I'd use it every day!". If PartyBlaze is like that, I think SEO isn't really the core of marketing it. You need to find where you customers go and get in front of their eyeballs.

If I were in your shoes, I'd start regionally. Start a newyork.partyblaze.com (or wherever you live) and that will make advertising easier... Think of how Craigslist.org started (San Francisco ONLY) and grow organically.

To get your spirits up, read some biographies or autobiographies of famous entrepreneurs. Each and every one of them has had a pile of failures (other than Gates, who made a pact with the devil).

[hey_ dj]

Hey there...

Good Post... Seems like you are in a similiar situation as me..

First, I would like to say that statistics show that independent successful business owners rarely get rich from their early ventures. You said you have failed 3 times? Big Deal. It is a process and as long as you are learning something valuable everytime you fail then you have nothing to regret or be depressed about. Ever hear that saying... " Fall down 9 times get up 10 times?" It's true... I have had more failed business experiences then Pamela Anderson has had sex partners (that's a lot), but I am still am ambicious and motiviated to run my own successful business one day.

Here are a few tips I would like to offer you my friend... I am no expert, infact I am probably similiar to you in that I have dreams (literally) of running my own businesses and am always writing down ideas that come to me and I am always looking for opportunities.

1. Take responsibility for your own learning: : If you don't know something, take responsibility to learn about it. I am taking Business Law and Accounting next semester, they are not my favorite subjects, but they will potentially save me headaches later on.

2. Make work not feel like work So why is Donald Trump so successful? Why does Jay Leno make 40 Million + a year? Why does Tom Hanks get 30 Million a movie? It's because they are passionate about what they do. If computers are your thing then cool man, good for you. But think about your other interests that aren't online? How can you make money in those industries? Be creative man, start brainstorming ideas that don't necessarly revolve around the internet.

If you are successful in an industry you don't love are you going to be happy? Put it this way, my mom makes over 100,000 grand a year. She is moody, grumpy and did I say moody? You work for over 70% of your life, so you better be happy damn it.

"Don't climb the ladder of success to find out it's leaning against the wrong wall."

3. Don't stand still: I would rather fail running a business business then always think about starting a business and never doing it. No excuses, so waisting time, be effecient. Need business ideas? go sit down at the coffee shop for a few hours and pay attention. I bet you will have a few before you leave. Read books, magazines and articles, read success stories, they will motivate you.

You want the formula for success?

a.Start a business,

b. if it fails, recover (financially, emotionally and physically) , try something new

c. repeat until successful.

So there is my take on it man, I wish you success. The difference between successful people and non successful people is "extrordinary drive", extrodinary drive is created by doing what you love. Get motivated. Every time you are watching tv, sleeping or wasting time someone else is working on new business ideas.. be competitive, its healthy.

Hope to read about you in Forbes Magazine one day buddy

DJ

[Outta Hand]

Hey Talphin,

I myself started out very similar to yourself... with a lot of steam and energy but i realized the problem with that is a few things

Lack of Focus - I find myself chanting "Focus, Focus, Focus!" from time to time because i do get impatient. I am learning to be more patient but its never been a strong point of mine either. I used to throw myself into a lot of projects instead of solely focusing on one at a time. I realized that guys like Bill Gates, Ted Turner, etc all had to make the choice to focus and see things threw so i do the same more and more now.

I think the something you are referring to is that they need a set of goals, a clear strategy and a marketing plan.... you've conceived the idea but haven't put thought into the "footwork" involved to get people to using and viewing it. Have you written business plans for any of these businesses/projects? If you did you would probably start to see more success over the long run.

The NetYears site is nice and serves a purpose too, problem is that it could be seen as an a threat to privacy laws... if you are in the states i am not sure what laws govern on these issues but this could be seen as a "barrier". What have you done strategy / marketing wise to get the site noticed?

With mmocasino i see this being a good way to build a community of players over time. Its a good concept and with enough marketing or perhaps partnering with a gambling site it could really take off nicely. Not sure if you explored that opportunity but it might be one to think about. You could probably find some ways to monetize the site and get it turning revenue especially if you have a community using it.

Marketing is something you should start small with and build knowledge and concepts on over time. You don't have to be a "classroom" kinda guy or girl to really get into it... in fact the best marketers out there aren't conventional in most ways yet they are highly successful.

I am a little fuzzy on what you mean by this...

"3. ....Right now I want to find some big events, and find communities talking about it. I will then post the event details myself, and invite the community to RSVP to it on my post."

Well i would say Business law is a must just for the sake of understanding contracts and marketing couldn't hurt because as you've said thats a weak spot for you.

[nytronix]

hello there

perhaps i would like to comment as well

1. about partners. you know - depends on patners. 2 times in my life people tried to have me. thanx to God i realised that before they did simpliest thing is not to trust as mush as you can people. esspecially if you do not know person well. now we with my partner running webdesign company for a half year. i have no reason not to trust him. cause there have been cases when he could set me up to cafe his a** and I could not do anything about it.

2. why debts were on your side? strange that you started doing business in credit. in most cases you are supposed to have actives to cover dets just in case. as i remembered 60% of your own money and 40% of credit was ideal formula

3. nice that you don't like working for some fat-a** old guy driving home on ferrari i don't like either.

4. about marketing. explore the history of advertisements of milliondollarhomepage.com - very very and very good example to follow. you do not have to read book to learn online marketing - read blogs and forums - ask questions - people would help you. read more and more. learn how to be successfull on google. BTW "javascript:__doPostBack('top5Parties$_ctl5$linkMy Party','')" - such links are not so good seen on http://www.partyblaze.com/.

5. do not be so pessimistic - you MUST be lucky!

6. both your projects are cool. i like them. not cheap copycats. really - marketing - learn learn and learn.