[Aletheides]

Found this interesting article on Digg.

"Our society brainwashes people into thinking a college degree is a must- yet not only do statistics show a degree no longer guarantees a higher income, but a large body of students are accepted knowing they will spend years trying to pass- and won't."

[tazman9r]

Here we go again...

[jasaunders]

That article is fatally flawed in so many ways, I don't even know where to begin. But I guess I'll try...

1. The article begins by talking about how students in the bottom of their high school class go to college even though they shouldn't. And how they don't graduate or even when they do graduate they end up taking low-paying jobs. Well I feel like this is common sense - smarter, brighter, more motivated people will do better, they will graduate at higher rates and get better jobs at graduation. I'm not sure what the article is trying to argue other than less intelligent people do more poorly in college, which is common sense.

2. Of the lower 40% of a high school class that isn't prepared for college (according to the author), "four-year colleges admit and take money from hundreds of thousands of such students each year!" Yes, some colleges will take anyone. But these kids who received C averages in high school aren't going to Harvard. The education you get and the job you get when you graduate is strongly influenced by the school you go to. Schools that have strong academic standards won't accept these bottom 40% of students. Sure, low tier schools will accept anyone, but isn't that the student's responsibility to decide to go to a low tier school?

3. "Also, the past advantage of college graduates in the job market is eroding. Ever more students attend college at the same time as ever more employers are automating and sending offshore ever more professional jobs, and hiring part-time workers. Many college graduates are forced to take some very nonprofessional positions, such as driving a truck or tending bar." This quote is just made up bullshit. Unemployment in this country is not skyrocketing, skilled jobs are still being created here. The jobs being outsourced are unskilled labor positions. Thus it is more essential to have a college degree because unskilled jobs are going away.

4. "Colleges and universities are businesses, and students are a cost item, while research is a profit center. As a result, many institutions tend to educate students in the cheapest way possible" Well, this statement couldn't be more wrong. First of all, many universities are publicly owned and generate no income for the government. They are there solely to provide education to students. Research does bring in the money, but without the teaching, there would be no university. These schools primary goal is to produce educated students who will contribute to their local economies and global economies in support of their institution. In addition, public schools have many checks and balances to ensure students get the proper education.

So what about private schools? Do they "educate students in the cheapest way possible"? It's a free competitive market. There are thousands of schools competing against eachother. Sure, no name colleges or online schools are going to educate you as cheaply as possible, they are run as a business and that is their target market (people who need a piece of worthless paper). Most private schools are in competition with others. They won't provide cheap education, because they can't afford to otherwise students would stop enrolling. If Harvard started providing cheap education, you think students wouldn't stop going and start applying in higher numbers to other Ivy League schools?

5. The author claims that colleges need to be regulated. They state "Colleges should be held at least as accountable as tire companies are. When some Firestone tires were believed to be defective, government investigations, combined with news-media scrutiny, led to higher tire-safety standards. Yet year after year, colleges and universities turn out millions of defective products" The author forgets its a competitive market! If one school sucks, then students have the choice to go to ten thousand other schools. Firestone tires killed people when consumers were in the dark about the product. In this case, consumers aren't in the dark. Consumers can freely choose their school based on vast information out there. And best of all, it you don't like your school you can always transfer. This case has absolutely no relation to government scrutiny of tires!

6. The author states "I ask colleges to do no more than tire manufacturers are required to do. To be government-approved" The author is an idiot. Schools are accreddited by independent organizations. Only certain schools are able to receive acreditation by organizations based on their rigorous auditing of the school. If you go to an unaccredited school or some bullshit moneymill school, well you get what you pay for.

7. I could keep going on and on, but I'll stop now. The main point is that people have choices and not every school is a good fit for everyone. And not everyone with a degree gets the same jobs as someone else. Just because you got a 4 year degree doesn't mean you are equal to everyone else. Someone who got a degree from the University of Phoenix Online is not going to get a job at a top consulting firm. For the author to generalize and say that all colleges are failing people is incredibly ignorant. Some schools suck and if you decide to go to a bad school, well that's your choice. If you are able to go to a better school and decide to go that route, you will be better off and receive a solid education.

[GuyBBY]

Great reply J- so true.

And Taz- I agree. This user however may not have meant it like the other recent "I HATE SCHOOL SO I WANT TO JUSTIFY IT" posts, but either way- this topic is being beat to death.

Guy

[jasaunders]

Yea, I'm not joining in on any more posts about the necessity of school for entrepreneurs. But I am a big advocate for education as a whole, so I will continue to fight for and defend the value of a college education and its benefits to society.

[JLeezer]

Nicely put Saunders. I couldn't have stated it any better, so I'm not going to try.

[Aletheides]

Good points jasaunders

[TryTryTryAgain]

Hello friend

[malumu200]

Originally Posted by Aletheides

Found this interesting article on Digg.

"Our society brainwashes people into thinking a college degree is a must- yet not only do statistics show a degree no longer guarantees a higher income, but a large body of students are accepted knowing they will spend years trying to pass- and won't."

Hey Aletheide careful. You just opened Pandora's box this subject has come up so many times its getting to be to funny. There is this struggle in the YE world of "going to school" or "not needing school" and both sides will have their arguments. I say let's just talk business and leave all this bullshit politics at home, if we wanted to talk about politics we would be on forums supporting George Bush.

Don't let me spoil the party Keep it going

[warrensway]

Here is all I really have to say on the topic. Colleges are a rip off, but it is only a rip off if you do what most college kids do via drink etc party. College has been and was a great incubator for my businesses and allowed me the time to grow them without all the financial pressure of having other bills to pay.